201 Bacterial infection!

[Rabbit]

One of my 201 females has a bacterial infection due to over feeding recently and the little amount of time i have been able to put in to them lately.
There is 3 201s in the tank 2 female 1 male only 1 has the infection and she is around 6.5-7cm.
Its a 2ft tank with a fluval cannister on it, iv increased the temperature to around 30-32dgc and added a uv stereliser at 9watts should this be enough to bring her back? the infection is decent (not so bad) reaching from half the caudle penducle to the rear of the dorsal fin.
Thanks for any help i cant say im too great with meds so any help would be appreciated.

 

[macvsog23]

Hi

You say a bacterial infection can you be a bit more specific?

Is this an external infection? Can you post a photo?

At a guess I would say if it is a sore or wound on the fish and on the back or the flanks of the fish. It will be related to a male chewing the fish to get her to stay in the cave.

As you mention over feeding and I suspect missed water changes I would quarantine this fish in a small tank were you could treat her.

One of the biggest killers with keeping fish is the relaxing of a feeding and water change regime.

I set a very strict time scale and plan for this.

Like most people who keep fish I have had experiences that have taught me the value of regular planed water changes, controlled feeding and a spare quarantine tank.

 

[Rabbit]

Thanks macvsog23
The infection is external moving its way to cover the fish, it has just started on the rear of the dorsla fin.
I dare say the infection started as a wound by the male.
Ill try and get a pic without disturbing her too much wont be a second.

 

[Rabbit]

The light makes it look a little worse than it actually is.

 

[Doodles]

If it is bacterial then triple sulfa might be the best bet. You haven't got that many meds in Aus

plus i would treat asap.

Turning the temp up increases the metabolism of the fish which helps the fish to heal quicker but it is added stress on top of the stress caused by the infection, its also likely to speed up the infection and if the plec isn't able to cope then will end up giving up. personally i would increase the temp with the addition of meds rather than rely on it alone.

 

[Jo Crane]

That looks more like trapping bashing wounds from the male to me I had a l201 loose all its scales and fins exactly like that but it was injury not infection, the pictures you show are very typical pleco scrapping injury. To treat I just keep on top of the water quality with very regular small water changes, clean the glass tank sides every couple of days to stop any bacteria build up this reduces the risk of secondary infection and the bottom of the tank if there is no substrate add some almond leaves if you have them and wait you will be shocked at how fast they recover that being said I do have a female L201 that has no tail spots anymore, I have a spawning L260 that gets injured by a rough male every few weeks the first time I saw it I panicked

 

[macvsog23]

I would move her ASAP and start with the Fix it twins prima and mela fix

This fish if it was mine I would use a small tank and keep her in it for a few weeks.

To stop this happening again several actions can be taken

But let us first examine the cause.

If we agree that it is due to the male chewing her to force her to spawn or to remove her from a cave. We need to understand the reason for this action. Accepting that all male fish once they reach sexual maturity will try to spawn, it can only be if the female is not willing or not ready to spawn that will make the male show aggressive behaviour towards her, a sort of sexual excitement.

Some species are more prone to this behaviour. Any one who has tried to spawn L134 will know this.

Extra caves may help as she can find a cave that will be to her liking and in general males will not try to force a female to spawn if she is in a cave that the male has not selected for spawning.

From my point your tanks size is possible the main cause of this problem. Do the L201, s share this tank? Do you have “Line of sight” markers ie stones that are distinctively different to the substrate? The later will help in establish territories for the male. A bog wood tangle is also helpful to make a fish feel safe and happy.

My opinion is that Hypans are more aggressive during a spawning due to the very small size of the groups of fish in the wild. I believe in nature they are very localised and only found in very small amount. This aggressive behaviour during spawning would force females to accept the male and thus this gene that aids survival would become a dominating gene. In nature should the female become injured this would heal as the area of water that they are in is large and fresh with very little bacteria.



I have my group of 6 x L201, s in a 18” cube and have seen no aggressive behaviour or chewing, having said this with feeding only every 3 or 4 days and daily 5% water changes, should a female have been chewed I would not expect to see the wound spread.
I have had L030 chew a female very badly and with a treatment of the fix it twins I have had the wound clear up in a few days.

So to conclude
Treatment would be the fix it twins with regular water changes and good housekeeping.

Prevention would be rearranging the tank and maintaining a regular water change and feeding program, good housekeeping to maintain a clean and healthy environment.

I would also once I have every thing under control and maybe a larger tank, add to this group as I have found that the option to select from several females can reduce the aggressive actions of a male.
I do know of one member who brought part of a group of L411, s from me and had no spawning but when he added the remaining / missing fish the group performed on a scale that was amazing.

One item I have found that helps with keeping a good environment are Almond leaves.

Joes Zebs is about the best place to get them on the net

I trust this helps and

 

[macvsog23]

Joe beat me to it on the leaves.

Oh and a question is there a place called wagga wagga ? honestly?

 

[Irene0100]

I agree, lots of w/c and the melafix and pimafix to help heal and reduce any infection.
I think it looks like she has been attacked too.

 

[intrepidmax]

Mac that's some really good info. very interesting.

rabbit I would be very careful at this point to what and how you manage the tank. any chems you put in the tank (or quarantine tank) will promote stress. (the higher temp will do this too) and in turn as you know could cause a loss of this fish.

Personally. and IMO wouldn't quarantine the fish and would treat in the tank. I would raise the temp (slowly) and I would use the UV. I would be thinking twice about using meds. but if I had to...I would use something herbal based...I would also only use half the dosage stated.

I would also consider moving the PH.

I personally think the key to this problem is (as mac said) really good husbandry of the tank. I think with lots of small water changes it would help the fish loads.

best of luck.

 

[Rabbit]

Thanks everyone, this female was added to the pair after they were established but the male seems to preffer her.
Iv added the uv lifted the tank temp will add almond leaves when i can get a hold of some. Id preffer not to quarantine her so i have her in a large trap in the same tank as to keep the male away.
Im not one for using meds if i can treat with temp water parameters etc but will slowly over a 2 day period add the full dosage of pimafix and melafix via my drip system.
Iv also slightly dropped the pH from 7.4 down to 6.8 to ensure comfort.
She dosnt appear to be in any stress so im assuming what i can see is the injury and a slight bacterial infection on the dorsal fin that seems to have taken off some of the soft tissue.
Will keep you all updated.
Thanks for the help.
Oh and Mac yep wagga wagga is a real place the name means place of many crows but im yet to see a crow.

 

[Doodles]

Good Luck:yes:

Make sure you do water changes as said.

If the infection does get worse, i would think about trying the sulfas.

 

[bikerman6660]

fully agree with the above comment raising the water quality will promote faster healing

 

[Rabbit]

Will do Lisa,
I noticed the "problem" while doing a water change but will do another come wednesday.
I have done a mild dosage of both melafix and pimafix.
Have also changed the decor around added 1 extra cave and will keep a close observation.
The temp has made it to 32dgc from 27.5 in around 4hrs she seems ok, i have also covered her the tank with a towel so the kids walking past etc should cause any fright.

 

[macvsog23]

I think you have taken the right course mate

Sadly very few people have a fish house
I do count my lucky stars on this one any problems can be faced

Thanks for the info on Wagga Wagga

I thought it was a made up name by Poms just like Bong Bongo land or Vin Drin Lop

The most odd name I ever came across was a very small hamlet that the locals called **** **** in Cambodia, I am still sure the locals made it up to joke me .
After all they did try to get me to eat monkeys brains by telling me it would make me very sexual active and no woman would be able to say no!!
sadly for them I did know that this was not so and it was a loaty dinner

 

[Irene0100]

have you truned tank lights off too? that will reduce stress.

 

[Jo Crane]

You look to be doing all you can right now best of luck with her let us know how you get on

 

[thegeeman]

I would move her ASAP and start with the Fix it twins prima and mela fix

This fish if it was mine I would use a small tank and keep her in it for a few weeks.

To stop this happening again several actions can be taken

But let us first examine the cause.

If we agree that it is due to the male chewing her to force her to spawn or to remove her from a cave. We need to understand the reason for this action. Accepting that all male fish once they reach sexual maturity will try to spawn, it can only be if the female is not willing or not ready to spawn that will make the male show aggressive behaviour towards her, a sort of sexual excitement.

Some species are more prone to this behaviour. Any one who has tried to spawn L134 will know this.

Extra caves may help as she can find a cave that will be to her liking and in general males will not try to force a female to spawn if she is in a cave that the male has not selected for spawning.

From my point your tanks size is possible the main cause of this problem. Do the L201, s share this tank? Do you have “Line of sight†markers ie stones that are distinctively different to the substrate? The later will help in establish territories for the male. A bog wood tangle is also helpful to make a fish feel safe and happy.

My opinion is that Hypans are more aggressive during a spawning due to the very small size of the groups of fish in the wild. I believe in nature they are very localised and only found in very small amount. This aggressive behaviour during spawning would force females to accept the male and thus this gene that aids survival would become a dominating gene. In nature should the female become injured this would heal as the area of water that they are in is large and fresh with very little bacteria.



I have my group of 6 x L201, s in a 18†cube and have seen no aggressive behaviour or chewing, having said this with feeding only every 3 or 4 days and daily 5% water changes, should a female have been chewed I would not expect to see the wound spread.
I have had L030 chew a female very badly and with a treatment of the fix it twins I have had the wound clear up in a few days.

So to conclude
Treatment would be the fix it twins with regular water changes and good housekeeping.

Prevention would be rearranging the tank and maintaining a regular water change and feeding program, good housekeeping to maintain a clean and healthy environment.

I would also once I have every thing under control and maybe a larger tank, add to this group as I have found that the option to select from several females can reduce the aggressive actions of a male.
I do know of one member who brought part of a group of L411, s from me and had no spawning but when he added the remaining / missing fish the group performed on a scale that was amazing.

One item I have found that helps with keeping a good environment are Almond leaves.

Joes Zebs is about the best place to get them on the net

I trust this helps and

:goodpost:

The best post I have read in ages. The scary thought is mac typed it:huh:

Cheers

thegeeman

 

[Rabbit]

Thanks all, i have turned the lights off and will leave them off until i feel she has come round. Feeding very little at the moment to help keep my water quality up.
She is alive and looking well this-morning and remains quite active.
Cheers

 

[young1nj]

It might not be a big deal but Im just curious why you changed your ph from 7.4 to 6.8. Wouldn't that add stress to the fish?