L46 success

mikebren12

Member
Nov 25, 2010
218
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Wynyard Co Durham
Hi folks...

I started with 4 fry purchased from a breeder in Middlesbrough(Apr 12) And added another from another breeder near Crewe(June 12). I quickly realised I wasn't happy with the way I'd gone about it. And decided I would look around for some adults...

In September 12, Rare aquatics in Crewe advertised sexed pairs, and I bit the bullet, securing a pair for collection in October.. The juvvies and the pair were moved into there new home, a 90l fluval Roma tank. The only other tank mates are cherry shrimp...

The tank is filtered with an Eheim classic 2213 external and an Eheim Biopower 200. A thin layer of black sand is on the bottom of the tank. The tank was decorated with small slate caves spread around underneath shelves of slate.

The fish seemed ok.

In Feb 13 I managed to secure another female from Rare aquatics. I also at this time changed the slate caves to clay caves again purchased from Rare..

Also I added an Eheim aquaball 45 and installed this at the bottom of the tank pointing the flow right across the caves.

I was told to increase the temp to 30.oC which I did at this time..

Throughout this process I was feeding them frozen bloodworm, lobster eggs, tetra prima, along with new era Pleco tabs, and new era flake...

My husbandry regime involved 2X 40% water changes weekly and then treating tap water with Prime...

Its easy to get frustrated, with not much happening, or seemingly not much happening... Whilst selling some cherry shrimp to a customer In May 13, (I should point out from my L260 tank), I noticed some small plec shaped fish darting about... Success!!!! In that tank anyway..

My thoughts were fantastic... I've bred some plec's. I must be doing something right.... I'd had various bits of advice about water quality, change to ro, change to hma, if not don't use prime. But it was ok for the 260's, so surely it must be ok for the 46's...

I carried on, 3 more spawns from the 260's.. Nothing from the 46's. They didn't even seem to go anywhere near each other..

In October I changed their food, started feeding just ground up prima, and lobster eggs and blood worm... Nothing changed...

At the end of November, I came down to the tank and noticed the heater-stat glowing red, and I mean like the whole element was red... I looked at the thermostat and I said 32.8oC, I nearly had a cow, I quickly changed it over and must of set it mistakenly to 28.5oC. (I could of kicked myself really as I'd had the new jaeger heater since June and couldn't be bothered to swap it over).

A week later the male had the female trapped in the cave...
Progress....

The female left the cave a few days later, and the male stayed. I was very excited, too excited. After 3 days I came home from work to find the cave empty and the remains of the clump of eggs bouncing around the bottom of the tank.

I was gutted, but managed to put what remained in a breeding trap. There were 4 left whole and about 12 empty shells. 2 became fungused and 2 hatched, but perished soon after...

Although extremely disappointed by what had occurred, I carried on with the same regime, and then just over a week ago I noticed another trapping, which must of been towards the end as they switched caves and the male remained in the 2nd cave with eggs which have since hatched, to date I can see little fry with what remains of their egg pouches attached..

I've attached a pic of my setup for those interested..


I hope this helps with anyone struggling to breed plec's....
 

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Brengun

Global Moderators
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Apr 22, 2009
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Burrum Heads, Queensland, Australia
Nice report. Every tip is helpful for those trying to get zebs breeding as the wait can be so frustrating.

Once they get into breeding mode they should spawn every 2 to 3 weeks. Its getting them started is the hard part.

Mine have been having a breeding rest for a few months now but imagine they will get back into it when the rainy season starts.
We get plenty of high temp days but its the barometric lows which really turn them on.

I would not make the main breeding cave the support piece for the entire slate structure. Is there a way to use a less popular cave or a rock to support that and free the cave a little?

I have a couple of females like to hit on the one male. One female will kick the others eggs out and lay her own. I try to swipe the first lot of eggs if that is looking like a recurring problem but I only have to remove one piece of slate and slide the cave out. Not rearrange the entire tank décor.

If left alone I only find a few of my fry survive in the tank loose so I usually swipe the fry out of the cave before they leave the log. They are raised in a fry saver in the parent tank until big enough to survive in a tank of their own.
 

mikebren12

Member
Nov 25, 2010
218
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Wynyard Co Durham
Hi Brengun,

The thought had crossed my mind about the cave and the structure, and I may well look at this once they are settled a little better into there routine, (spawning). At the moment the male is really spooked as soon as I open the lid on the tank. But thank you for the comments...


Mike
 

ajm

Member
Aug 24, 2013
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6
South Australia
Hi Mike

Just wondering what fish you have in the top of that tank? I have some black neon tetra's in mine.

Why did you think purchasing fry was the wrong way to go? Was it because it would take so long to get them breeding? I am interested in breeding my L46 too but have started with juevenilles so far, only 2 at this stage. I am definitely looking at adding another 4 - 6 more with time and money but will only be able to afford young ones. I know I'm in for years of waiting though...

Great to read of your success, if you get a chance post pics of the fry when they are out and about. I would be very interested in hearing how many you get to survive leaving them to it naturally. I hate the idea of taking eggs and fry out of the main tank in order for them to survive. However, if they don't survive any other way then I understand. I just wonder how the fry go when trying to breed themselves when older when they were artificially raised? I'm always interested to hear of people who manage to leave them to it and have them survive :)

Good luck :)

Cheers
 

mikebren12

Member
Nov 25, 2010
218
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Wynyard Co Durham
Hey amanda,

Tbh the reason i was displeased was more to do with the unscrupulous seller who managed to get away with selling me 4 snub-nose zebs. As it was my 1st venture into zebs, i hadnt realised that this was possible...

However as they grew it became very apparent.....

And around the same time the w/c adults became readily available, and didnt break the bank.... So kind've a double edge sword really....

It wasnt so much that i was wanting to breed them, it was more the fact id paid for substandard fish. Really annoyed me....

But you live and learn....

The fish at the top of the tank are pseudomugil gertrudae if that helps :D

As for buying fry my intention was to grow them on, and hopefully there would be a mix of males and females. Sell on the ones that were extra's.
Incidentally i still have the 3 remaining snubs growing on, as i couldnt bring myself to cull them...

Yes it will be interesting to see the survival rate. Im hoping at least 50%. But im no expert... Currently there are 10 fry, one is much bigger than the others leading me to believe there was in fact a double spawn.

The reason for this, is one has no egg sac at all, and the others have just hatched, i can neither confirm or deny whether its two different females or the same one, hoping for the former of course...

The male seems a little more fatherly and isn't leaving the cave as much this time, so i presume practise makes perfect....



Mike
 

ajm

Member
Aug 24, 2013
62
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South Australia
That's great Mike, congratulations!

Yeah I would be annoyed about the snub noses too, but also couldn't cull them. I'm sure they are fine as long as you don't breed from them. There's room in the world for every different shape and size :)

Good luck.

Cheers
 

bigbird

Pleco Profiles Moderator - RIP FRIEND
Sep 9, 2010
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Sydney, AUSTRALIA
well done and it will get better. practise makes perfect, but at least you can say you were successful which many cannot say or claim. cheers jk :thumbup:
 

mikebren12

Member
Nov 25, 2010
218
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Wynyard Co Durham
So it's been some 8 months since I last posted.

The zebs seem settled and have pretty much spawned every 3-5 weeks, with varying degrees of success where numbers are concerned..

Originally they were cited in a 90l aquarium which was sited in the hallway of our home between the kitchen, study and living room.. After a couple of spawns I became concerned with the amount of viable fry he was releasing in the tank as numbers varied from 3-5, which due to others experiences seemed extremely low...

After a couple of months I took the decision to move them to a larger tank in the dining room, which housed a breeding group of 260's....

It was a nerve racking changeover and I was hopeful I hadn't disrupted their spawning routine...
After 5 weeks they spawned again but with the near same end result.... I was still disappointed with the fry result but extremely pleased with the continuation of the spawning.... I kept a close eye on them....


But it appears too close.... It dawned on me STOP SHINING THE BLOODY TORCH IN...

so this last month I've left them alone once they'd spawned and guess what, 12 fry released, yep 12...... My advice, throw the torch in the bin.....
So don't shine a torch in....


Mike
 

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Raul-7

Member
Oct 21, 2011
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CA
Good advice. I also think a lot of human interaction interrupts their natural process [meaning a breeding tank in a basement vs one in the TV room will provide different results].

Aren't you worried about cross-breeding? L46xL260 hybrids have been formed in Germany.
 

mikebren12

Member
Nov 25, 2010
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Wynyard Co Durham
Thanks Raul...

Sorry I think I misinterpreted my meaning, I meant I swapped them into the L260 tank... The L260 were re-housed...

I keep species only tanks.......


Mike
 

mikebren12

Member
Nov 25, 2010
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Wynyard Co Durham
Sorry it's taken me so long Paul, the forum was down for a while...

The Zebs keep on spawning, 14mths in a row, males sat on the latest batch of eggs atm. :clap::clap:

I've maybe got 30-40 fry growing on. And yes I do sell them on, but I'm not comfortable enough to post...

Pic is of the 1st fry sold...

Enjoy
 

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mikebren12

Member
Nov 25, 2010
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Wynyard Co Durham
Again, sorry for the late reply...

Temp 29.5 oC
TDS 125
Ph 7.2
I don't test very often and don't test for anything else... Mostly I can tell by the naked eye what's going on in most of the tanks.. fish behaviour and condition.
 

mikebren12

Member
Nov 25, 2010
218
0
16
Wynyard Co Durham
So after the continual spawning for some 20 mths, the zebra took a break in the early part of 2016, and in fact have recently just started spawning again, 2 spawns in consecutive months, which relieved my neurotic tendencies...

I've also switched to Hma filtered water, which seems to have made a difference across all breeding tanks, with more spawns in the 399 and 66 tanks..

Mike